Dal Saarschleife all'Ötztaler in meno di 6 ore?

Björn: Welcome to the Afasteryou Podcast, where everything revolves around endurance sports and training. Here, Sebastian Schluricke, Björn Kafka and Niclas Ranker give you valuable tips and insights to help you take your performance to the next level. Alright, welcome to a new episode of the Afasteryou Podcast. Good morning, Björn.

Niclas: Good morning, Niclas.

Björn: Just as fit as me. We need to time this better. I was just about to say, last week we were both pretty wrecked. Well, I actually thought today would be better already. A day after the race is always really rough, that's well-known, but two days after the race still being this wrecked? That's just how it is. But you won. Yeah, I did. It was good. It was fun above all. Very good. Congrats. Thanks. Should we jump into the episode with that? Then we've got the unpleasant topic out of the way. For me at least. Actually... It was the Saarschleife Marathon, my home race in a sense, because it's the only mountain bike marathon in Saarland. 97 kilometers, 2200 was the advertised elevation. I measured 2400 meters of elevation.

Niclas: You measured wrong though. You need to run some filtering on it. In reality it's probably only 2200.

Björn: Yeah, probably only 2200. But... That was the course where I crashed last year in training and where the German Championships were held last year. And since I hadn't been able to win my home race yet, I'd almost say this year was basically my season peak. We can do off-season now, Björn.

Niclas: Mega. Hey, tell me, you went... three hours, how fast?

Björn: Hand-timed it was 3:54, I think the official time says 3:53:8 or so. What was ridden at the German Championships? At the German Championships, Seewald shot the thing down in just over 3:40. Yeah, unpleasant. So with my time from this year, I would've been twelfth at last year's German Championships. Also not bad. I'd say the same. If I'd been twelfth at last year's German Championships, I would've been happy. That's a result where you say, you can work with that. That's totally okay. I think last year there were still some cross-country riders there. No, there weren't many cross-country riders at the start.

Niclas: But it was a well-stacked race. And especially if you've been riding alone more or less up to that point, rode away by about three kilometers this year. When you're still in the race, then maybe you can mobilize a bit more.

Björn: Exactly, those are a few points I wanted to address, because I was asked by one of my athletes, yeah, what power numbers do you need to win this? And when I look, for example, just at my power numbers, this year in Willingen I rode more watts for over an hour longer. So just the raw power numbers, I didn't find that crazy. Yeah. My advantage, I think, was simply that I knew the course inside and out, and I told Matthias Frohn before the start what I was going to do. At the beginning, after kilometer 3, there's this dip, you ride a long left turn over gravel, then it goes onto asphalt, then it goes down, and then comes this 3-minute climb if you ride it full gas. And I knew the others didn't have a 38-tooth chainring, so I rode that left turn perfectly, hammered it with 500 watts, shot through the dip and just opened a gap over the chainring, and then I was alone. And then they didn't close it back up, and I looked at the times this morning. Afterwards on the descent, and then there's a section where you have to ride about six kilometers flat through the forest path. And alone on that descent, on that segment, I already gained a minute of time. And then the race was basically, in quotes, already done, because after that I just paced cleanly, I checked, I rode the climbs just as fast as Frohn, who was basically always in the chase group, and on the flat sections they couldn't take anything back from me. And then the thing was actually relatively relaxed, but I also said to Paul Häuser as an example, if I had a partner, on the flat sections in all those passages where you, let's say, have to work, you'd ride faster, because you just rotate, chill at Fatmax in the slipstream, and the other one goes full gas, and then there would've been even more. So maybe at the German Championships with a good group, faster, but maybe also blown up, you never know.

Niclas: Exactly, that's the other thing, if you stand in lactate for half an hour at the start, the end can really go sideways.

Björn: Yeah, I think, I have to say, I actually really like these very consistent races, that suits me, I can pace myself very well over a long time, that really worked, so I rode 353 over that time, 343 NP, 287 average, and had, in quotes, only an average heart rate of 165. So I never really had to go deep. Except for the attack, I was never really over 175 heart rate. And that's, in quotes, relaxed when you can just pace it cleanly.

Niclas: Tempo training with Niclas Ranker. How do I lower my lactate production rate?

Björn: It was basically just a hard training session we did. We wanted to bring the lactate production rates down a bit anyway.

Niclas: That was the plan.

Björn: That was training. It worked. Exactly. So I think what you can take from it: course knowledge is super important. Tactics worked perfectly in this case, and I think when I look at the sections, especially the flat sections, I didn't push more watts than the others, but I still rode faster. I just pulled it through ice-cold, always tucked tight. I still have muscle soreness in my triceps today. And in the neck, because I tried to sit aerodynamically the whole time. And I think, even in mountain bike marathon, I know, a lot of people think mountain biking isn't really about aerodynamics. It makes such a huge difference. You ride one, two km/h faster over the entire marathon. At the end I had a five-minute lead. And I think the climb times were basically always the same as Matthias Frohn's. And at the end I still had five minutes. So that's just... You have to internalize it, you have to train this position, and I think then you can ride really fast.

Niclas: Yeah, very cool. I remember, I dare to recall, weren't you a bit unsure whether you could ride this thing fast or not? We basically did nothing except base, heat, and a bit of threshold.

Björn: Yeah, in the end my problem was more that after Andorra, which was completely at altitude, I felt terrible. And especially Andorra itself, I think, didn't go well for me. Because altitude really took me out. And I was just really shaken. Okay, do you even have the performance to ride fast for over four hours there? But I have to say, training worked. Very good. Cool. Nothing to say. Yeah, now unfortunately comes another race at altitude, Swiss Epic. Even higher.

Niclas: Who are you riding with again?

Björn: Again with Aaron. Altitude doesn't bother him, unfortunately.

Niclas: Yeah.

Björn: We just have to set the wattage values beforehand and then I have to ride cruise control. I just can't overdo it, otherwise it'll be like Andorra again. That would be unpleasant. So. Now for the actual highlight of last week, right?

Niclas: Tour de France. Yeah. Tour de France. Yeah, the Tour was mega. Man, it was good. How sick was the last stage? I had this crazy ride. I had to... drive up north again, another 1000 kilometers, and I nicely arrived at the last half hour, so to speak, or almost, yeah, last half, three-quarters of an hour. Okay. And family, they were with me, had it running on the phone, and when the group went with Jorgenson and Pogačar and obviously Wout van Aert and Trentin, and the Astana guy, we forgot him. Well, when the group... Exactly. Then they naturally asked right away, who wins? And then I said... That was still the group when Girmay and so on were in it. Exactly, the group was still relatively big. Then I said, Girmay, if he comes over, it'll be tough. Or Van Aert. And well, thingy was still in it, right? The one from Merida. Ah, Mohorič. Mohorič. I thought, wow, the way he came down there.

Björn: Hey, I was just about to say, he was downhill. He thought, no, last day, I'm going full risk. Just rode everything that was possible downhill.

Niclas: Hospital or whatever, doesn't matter, right? And yeah, then I could watch the finish again... on the big TV, and what a sick stage, and I've already been, I go to Paris often, I'm going again in a few days, and I know the area there pretty well, and it's sick riding through Montmartre like that. Yeah, sick, just the atmosphere is mega, and I thought, ah fuck, why am I not there, didn't work out, and at least on that stretch, and yeah, if you experience the Tour in Paris, that's sick.

Björn: Yeah, I was there two years ago, we were there too, and I thought, so we couldn't really get that close to the course because we arrived way too late. Yeah. That we really saw the riders up close. But the atmosphere around it, that alone is completely crazy. The whole city is on its feet. Everyone is celebrating cycling. Brilliant. So it's really sick.

Niclas: Super. I've been there a few times. Was also in the back of the team car on the... Champs-Élysées and it's really sick when you drive through there, it's just super loud, I mean the crowds, it's super loud, even in the car, you sit there and everyone is yelling at you, and you think, dude, what's going on, so it's really, really cool, and yeah, Paris is just a sick city when it comes to sports, and that was also at the Olympic Games now, I was there too, for a week, and I rode everywhere. We always went down from Sèvres. I have the advantage that we have a little house there, my father-in-law does. And then we always rode through Paris on the bike. And Paris during the Olympic Games was super cool because everything was blocked off, or a lot of it. And the police were completely relaxed too, I loved it, yeah, so you thought, they always looked so mean, but they were totally nice and helpful, and with Paris, I could finally ride routes that I can't ride otherwise, it was all so beautifully built in, yeah, they really have a... great sense of aesthetics to build these stadiums into this city, yeah, mega, mega, mega and mega stage, mega Tour, it was just super fun to watch.

Björn: I thought the images, this Montmartre climb, the way they were all standing on the big staircase, so it's always fully packed.

Niclas: It's always, always packed. Now it was ultra packed. Yeah, so anyone who's never seen the Tour, always go. It's so sick. It's just, also the mountains. My first Tour was 96 or 97, I don't even know, did Ullrich win that year? Was it 96? I have no idea. Ullrich won in 97, 96 was Riis. I wasn't around yet. Exactly, 98 Pantani. And then for a long time it was Armstrong. Who came after Armstrong? I think one year Oscar Pereiro. Then came those years where no one really knew, with Floyd Landis, Rasmussen. Then eventually Contador and Wiggins, and Schleck too. Schleck too, exactly, belongs to, let's say, that time when no one knew who would win. Exactly, Schleck, Contador, and then... Then came Sky, actually earlier. Then came Sky, though one year they didn't win, Nibali won. Right. That was the year Froome broke his foot somehow on that cobblestone stage and they didn't take Wiggins, even though he was in bomber shape. Exactly. And then came Sky. And then eventually the others.

Björn: Poker challenge. I thought it was, what I really found crazy, time was neutralized, basically there was nothing left for Pogačar to win, in quotes, except the stage win of course. And that he still went full gas with the yellow jersey and didn't bring anyone along, even though if he crashed and basically, in quotes, dropped out, he'd lose the Tour after all, even though it was neutralized. Yeah. I thought, dude, you're such a sick guy. You can tell he just wants to ride his bike fast. And whenever possible, full gas.

Niclas: That's a sick image, how epic it would be to win this stage in the yellow jersey. I got that right, right? Yeah, of course. That's mega. And it was really a close thing too. But Van Aert just did it, and when he had Jorgenson with him, the topic was already really done. You have to shut every gap. They were all already dead. And when he attacked Montmartre, I didn't think he'd seal the deal there, but that maybe it would come down to a sprint.

Björn: But I thought it was so sick. The way Wout van Aert drove over everyone and the gap he opened up at the end of that climb in the last 400 meters. He must've pushed everything he had.

Niclas: Everything, everything. And that course, I've ridden it often on my bike, it's just hell. And with it wet, it's just... Last year in the time trial, they crashed so brutally. Especially the women crashed so nastily. I think the American time trialist, I forget her name, who's actually a triathlete with serious power. I crashed five times. And I thought, people, it's just ice-slick everywhere there. And when they came down Montmartre, there was some leaf stuff, leafy mess. Yeah, pollen, blossoms.

Björn: That yellow stuff, yeah. And I was like, oh...

Niclas: I assume they scrubbed the street down hard beforehand. That's how I always estimate them. They really do that. And then I thought, oh, hammering down there at that speed, that everything... But then you see from the side how he rides over this cobblestone patchwork tea-cloth. And this street is just bom, bom. And you see the bike working. They got really thick tires for road bikes. Dude, crazy. And through these puddles. And he did it. It was mega. It was just unbelievable.

Björn: I have to say, an athlete like Wout van Aert in this situation, you can really grant the man that. And especially in the way that he just, Pogačar, I think in the evening on Instagram Matteo Jorgenson and Campenaerts also joked about how Wout van Aert was now the first rider in the last two years to drop Pogačar from his back wheel. Yeah. Could be, right?

Niclas: Yeah, yeah, could well be. So that was already, yeah. But you saw Pogi at the finish, and he was just dead, face all swollen up, yeah sure, from the nerves and so on. I think he doesn't even feel like riding anymore. He doesn't want to now. Nothing happening. I think they're all doing the Remco Evenepoel diet now. And just McDonald's from now on. All dead, Visma too.

Björn: I actually believe, because a lot was said about it, yeah, why didn't Pogi attack anymore in the last week and stuff, where I thought, people, the guy is sick.

Niclas: And he's also done.

Björn: He rode sick and gray the last week, and still no one could shake him off. That was just perverse.

Niclas: Yeah, so they were, everyone was just dead, no one could take it easy. At the Tour. Nice race. I'm looking forward to the next edition. I'm curious. I thought the Montmartre thing was mega. I'd like to see that more often. Sure, then of course the sprinters can't anymore and you don't see that anymore. That's a shame for them. And sure, a big sprint finale is always nice too. But I thought this was just way sicker, I have to say honestly. Had a lot more fun.

Björn: Because normally the Champs-Élysées, you know, okay, the sprinter teams will control it so that it definitely comes down to a mass sprint. And then they ride there, always like, five to ten riders attack, but you know, okay, they won't make it through safely. And the finale, you sat in front of the TV for the last 40 kilometers and didn't know, okay, who wins now, what's going on, what's happening? Brilliant.

Niclas: Yeah, I mean, also for the commentators it's sick, because normally when you commentate, going up and down the Champs-Élysées once, it's super boring. Someone attacks, you know exactly, pff, nothing's gonna happen. You have to pull something out of your nose. Exactly. Something, and do you remember, 1900, whatever, 94, when Laurent Jalabert crashed into a policeman, blah blah blah, yeah, like that.

Björn: And now full gas finale like a sick one-day race. That was really good.

Niclas: Yeah, I think, I'm gonna be mean here, I actually always find the sprint in Paris a bit boring. Even though it's always said to be the biggest thing, and as a sprinter it's sick, and then Mark Cavendish wins there, and André Greipel also won a few times. I remember at least once. At least once for sure. But I still find it somehow... I just don't think it's the sickest sprint in the world. It's just... There are cooler sprint finishes. It's also wide, it's not that hectic, and it's, yeah, no.

Björn: I have to honestly say, I never find these very controlled sprints as exciting as when there's a bit more chaos or a harder approach where you can already see, okay, there's a certain selection happening. I find that more attractive most of the time. Yeah, definitely. But... How do you feel about the third-placed, Florian Lipowitz? Yeah, that's mega.

Niclas: That's sick. Hammer. Hammer, hammer. Yeah, I'm super stoked for him. For the person basically. For German cycling I'm also super stoked. That's super. And there the team... what does team mean? The team made the lucky... grab to take this talent on back then. And I have to say, he hasn't had the sickest years.

Björn: Especially the last few years, even though his power numbers were good, he was also often sick, and never really delivered big results where you'd say, okay, WorldTour contract and you definitely get a spot and we're taking you on all the Grand Tours, there was a lot of trust and advance laurels flowing to him.

Niclas: So in the background I don't think it was always so smooth either, like, hey, you're staying in the team now and getting a contract, blah blah blah. No, I'd say, despite many doubters, certainly also from the team side, he held his ground and pulled this thing off. Because one thing you can't forget, team is always important, but at the end of the day, it's always an individual performance. Then indeed. And he just pulled it through, fully from... And we can't look in, how much team is behind it. I can only clearly say it about one team, and that's Visma, how much team is behind it. And there's a lot of team behind it. And yeah, from what I've picked up from afar, I have the feeling that with him, it's been an extremely individual performance. Over the years, over the years, right? How it was at the Tour, I can't say exactly.

Björn: Yeah, but I thought at the Tour, how he rode overall, you could also see he never let his head drop at any point. You could've said, on the day he lost so much time to Oscar Onley, where he came back to within 20 seconds in the GC, I could imagine there are some riders who would've been mentally cracked and thought, okay, this thing is done, he gave it to me so hard today. I won't manage the next day. There are also some who head more to McDonald's. For example? And he just stayed on it. Now Evenepoel is going to Bora, Red Bull. Looks like it, right? Becomes the new teammate. No idea. So basically I have... a lot of respect for an Evenepoel. Crazy sick time trialist, also rides races well on his own. But I don't really like his attitude and this, yeah, I'm dropping out now because we have so many other goals in the year. Yeah, you can kind of understand it, but somehow I also think it's sicker when a rider bites through and fights, because there are so many other riders who would kill at nature for this spot, just to stand at the start. And when a rider, I'd say, even though he could've finished, doesn't finish and drops out, it's kind of a shame.

Niclas: Yeah, I'm curious how this works. I always find it difficult when you bring in several leaders, and especially two such super young guys who both have total ambitions. And I assume that Evenepoel clearly has more to offer on paper right now. Of course. Tour is still my thing. Sure, you can do that. And then they'll ride a few years. And I can also imagine that Lipowitz will say, okay, I'll ride for you now, but I'd like it a bit repaid. Like with Wiggins and Froome, Ullrich and Riis, whatever their names were. Or also Vingegaard and Roglič. Whether that works with those two? So I can imagine from Lipowitz's side, I can imagine, but whether Evenepoel would put himself in service if Lipowitz was stronger than Evenepoel at the Tour, if they even ride together. Would Evenepoel put himself in service of Lipowitz? Hmm.

Björn: I don't think so.

Niclas: I think he doesn't put himself in service of anyone. Doesn't matter, we don't need to talk about it. But it's exciting. Such a team constellation is exciting. Evenepoel has always been in discussion, Bora, or rather Red Bull.

Björn: In the end, Specialized is also pretty certainly behind it. They say, we don't give him up. He has to ride in a team where Specialized bikes are ridden. And on the other hand probably at Bora, clearly Red Bull, they say, we want an absolute top rider for the next years who brings the potential to take world championship titles, win the big classics. Win the Grand Tours, and on paper, let's say, we look before the Tour, before the Tour there were on paper, I think, for the next years, let's say the next five to ten years, actually three riders who bring that, and that's Pogačar, Vingegaard, and Evenepoel. Mhm. So those three. Sure, now after the Tour you can say, okay, Oscar Onley, Florian Lipowitz are also riders who will come in the next years and obviously have the potential. But fundamentally something probably had to happen from the team leadership so that you have a rider who delivers this Red Bull project in cycling in the coming years.

Niclas: Yeah, definitely. And it's about time for the team too. What's interesting is, my god, how long has this existed, yeah? So how long has this constellation with Denk and Raubling and so on existed? But I don't know if it's the same for you. I think this team has relatively little identity, as crazy as it sounds, yeah? Sure, you could say UAE doesn't have an identity either, but because Pogačar has been riding there forever, you have the feeling that UAE is Pogačar, and they have, so all those, you have all the riders. I really struggle with that at Red Bull. I remember, even Sagan, for me, somehow disappears in this team. Sagan to me is Cannondale.

Björn: Sagan to me, for example, is Saxo-Bank.

Niclas: or Saxo Bank, yeah, but to me Sagan is always somehow, uh, Cannondale, yeah, so Liquigas and so on, and, um, Bora, I really struggle, yeah, so they have good riders, sure, I mean, they win Vuelta somehow, win Giro, but it's so, it's so, it's so watered down, yeah, it's really hard, uh.

Björn: I thought, at Bora it was actually this German identity, this German thread, all top German riders ride with us. That's what I thought was actually Bora. Sure, you have to, if you want international and if you want the victories and the goals, sure, you then maybe need a rider like a Roglič, who, let's say, at the time they signed him, might've still had it in the tank. Or maybe still has. He still won the Vuelta last year. So still a top rider. But that, I thought, was actually the identity behind Bora. And now it's kind of... I don't know where the identity really is. I have the feeling, it's just Denk does everything to win the Tour. No matter the path.

Niclas: Yeah, so for me the identity of this team has never been really tangible. Even though it's a German team and this Band of Brothers, you somehow don't buy it. Then they always have tons of changes. It's always so... There's never this consistency. I mean, even the people who weren't there anymore somehow vanished too. And I think this team is a hard-to-grasp team. And with many other teams, they're tangible to me. I mean... Quickstep, Mapei, those were always teams where you buy the identity. Or Lefevere, you never think of him either. Sure you see him, but he's just not as eloquent as other team managers. He doesn't come across as cool. And yeah, I mean, how crazy is it, like Sky or Ineos, they have such a sick identity. Even when they ride badly, they just have this... This year they...

Björn: Ahrens's guy pulled the cart out of the mud so sick.

Niclas: Mega good, and of course with their, I wouldn't say affair, but after the documentary there and their longtime helper who apparently had something to do with doping and so on, and they didn't comment on it, which is of course difficult. Of course it's all a bit not great right now. And now we have to see what even comes out, if anything comes out. But they have a sick identity. And they just did that super well. And bound all these riders for such a long time. I mean, even Wiggins didn't leave the team on good terms. And Froome, after he crashed and was severely injured and then went to Israel, but still you totally connect these athletes with this team. And that still echoes. And it's a really English team. It totally echoes. I just don't have that with that team. And about the French teams we don't need to talk. It always resonates there. You also see it in the lineups, they have tons of French riders, after all, French teams, sure. Now of course you could also say, at Visma, I think there wasn't a single Dutchman at the start of the Tour, but through Van Aert, Campenaerts and co., you still have the feeling, there's an identity there. Now they rebuilt Rabobank. And the staff behind it is also, that's a staff where, so the employees there, that you, you know them, they're there a long time, Mathieu Heijboer and whatever their names are, you have the feeling, there's real identity behind it. Bora, I have my issues and not because somehow... It's difficult, right? Because Germans always talk down their own stuff. No, I just somehow can't really connect with it. And now, how many German riders are even left at Bora? Uh, at Red Bull? I don't even know.

Björn: Lipowitz, Ben Zwiehoff. Those are the only two I still know. Schachmann gone, Politt gone, uh... Schwarzmann gone. Kämna gone.

Niclas: Kämna gone.

Björn: Ackermann gone.

Niclas: But the bus still says German Cycling. Well. Whatever. I hope the thing goes up steeply. And I also see the youth development work being done there. Now we'll have to see if this topic... we produce our own Tour winner. That would be mega of course. Nothing would make me happier. That would be crazy. That's also an announcement somehow. That's surely the announcement from Red Bull, that they say, we pull from our development team, and so much is invested there. And you see how well they ride too. They really got themselves really good people. We want to create our own Tour winner now. Yeah.

Björn: Would be sick if they pull it off with Lipowitz. Definitely difficult, you have to say. Before that two guys have to drop out and struggle, in quotes.

Niclas: Pogačar is stopping in three years. He'll win the Tour seven or eight times at best. Then he has more than Armstrong.

Björn: Yeah, but look, he only has four now. That means he'd still need to do four more. Didn't he have, Ben Healy had him, there was a video where Ben Healy comes into the tent after some race and asks, hey Tadej, when are you stopping? When do we finally have a chance to win races? And he's like, yeah, I have a contract until 2030. That means Lipowitz beyond 2030.

Niclas: This year Pogačar is a bit, sure he's stoked, he wants to race, it's fun for him, he also makes a ton of money for it. But I think after a Tour like that, you think, dude, really, actually, I have so much money already, I could also...

Björn: stop. You know what I found today on the topic of Tadej Pogačar and how dominant he actually is? There's the UCI World Ranking. And I'll tell you now how many points places 3 and 2 have. Sure, Pogačar is in first. Then guess how many points Tadej Pogačar has. So place 3 today is Mathieu van der Poel with 4,366 points. Place 2 is Mads Pedersen with 4,555 points. How many points does Tadej Pogačar have? No idea, 7,000? 11,465 points. Crazy. Okay, but he does brutally many races. Yeah, and he wins all of them. And those are all the highest and best races that exist. It's completely bananas. The guy is 26 and already has 104 pro wins.

Niclas: Stable.

Björn: That's so sick.

Niclas: Yeah.

Björn: Also the way he rides, how he, I think, behaves. So he's just, he's just so nice. Look, no matter what happened in this Tour, like, he defended Jorgenson, saying, hey, that was my own mistake. How many riders would've said, yeah, that loser cut me off and pulled my front wheel out. He's always so nice, always so correct. I don't know. He seems like he's from another planet.

Niclas: I don't know him personally, I should say. I just know his coach pretty well and he gets along with him pretty well. And Fabio is also a super guy. So I'd assume the chemistry is right there. Yo, but Tour, we could still, I could talk about the Tour for hours. Also about past Tours. I think people won't be interested at some point. Now they can look it all up.

Björn: But one more question. What was your surprise of the Tour? At which moment did you really think, yeah sick, I wouldn't have thought that possible?

Niclas: First, that Vingegaard is so bad in the time trial. I wouldn't have thought that possible.

Björn: Especially since they have our software.

Niclas: I know, I'm a bit deeper into it. That was, and he says it himself, we don't need to talk about it, he just didn't push the numbers, done, over. Aerodynamics fit, it's super. He just didn't ride the numbers. Otakam also got to me, that was also a surprise for me, that first the attack was there, I thought was sick. Then multiple surprises. Positive, and you also have, we said it last time too, Team Visma really tore itself apart until the second-to-last day. I thought that was super. That's just how dominant this team is. I mean, even UAE, sure, with Nils Politt who rode in the wind the whole time, or Tim Wellens who really, and Narváez, sure, they did a lot. But UAE, always rode out front, relay station, really gave gas. My god, they really stamped their mark on it. I thought it was mega. They just put on a good show. And that's what makes it so interesting. Doesn't matter, now of course you can say, it was somehow a mistake here and a mistake there and they burned themselves out and then... When you listen to Wiggins and Armstrong and then they say how bad they're riding, or Riis also comments on it? I think, actually I don't agree.

Björn: My god, try to decide that, it's just super hard, yeah. I don't think they rode badly at any point. From the team performances, from the tactical team performances, Visma was actually always the team where you could most easily see as a, in quotes, layperson, not a road cyclist, okay, they have a plan there right now, they have something up their sleeve, they always had the groups covered, they always formed relay stations for the case that Vingegaard is in shape or could shake Pogi off. So I think, if there had been a weakness from Pogačar, then Visma would've been there, would've exploited it and would've taken the thing.

Niclas: And in hindsight it's always totally easy to say, here, there was a mistake. I mean, there were so many, and I thought that was so exciting about this Tour this year, that there were so many situations that weren't predictable like that. So we know it from all the years with Sky for example, they ride a tempo up, and it's completely controlled through. And this time it just wasn't like that at all. It was just, what was it? The stage... Was it Madeleine? Yeah, but I don't remember which one. So to, or Trump, I don't know, no idea. So when, uh, Oscar Onley had lost so much time, yeah? Yeah. On one stage and then came back. That was a really cool stage, because, up to the, you tear everything apart, at the first, at, yeah, so to speak, on the mountain before the big mountain, and everyone's like, wow, sick, now it's going off, and... But then suddenly everything turns around completely again, yeah. Behind, Oscar Onley comes back, Jorgenson isn't really in shape anymore, lets go in the front group, and you see, suddenly it's all been for nothing basically, yeah. So, puh, what was that now, yeah. You've somehow shaken everything around, and now it's coming together again anyway. But that's what's sick about cycling, yeah.

Björn: And I think you always have to add, they basically assume, the guys are all riding on the limit basically, and they're hoping, okay, maybe Pogačar will crack a mountain earlier today. Maybe he has some weakness, maybe the cold is too strong. And that's just, they just have to try. But I think, looking back in hindsight, you see, okay, they tried everything, but in the race it was always the case, okay, Pogačar just didn't crack, Pogačar just always stayed with them. And what are they supposed to do? The riders are also just humans, they can't push infinitely, and Pogačar just always stayed there. He was just on them, and then... yeah, what are they supposed to do?

Niclas: Yeah, so for me those were the moments I thought were exciting. It was overall a super exciting Tour, but that's above all due to Pogačar and Vingegaard. And the surprise of course Lipowitz, that he pulled it through for three weeks so super, totally positive, I thought was mega good. I also thought regarding the broadcast, the images are just getting sicker and sicker. I thought the commentary with Vogt and Carsten Migels and, what's the third one's name? There's also a fourth one, a woman there too. I unfortunately don't have the names in my head anymore. I thought it was super, I really liked it. It was never boring. There were good anecdotes. It was for the first time in a long while a Tour I totally enjoyed, although the past years too. Actually since Roglič got the jersey ripped off, the Tour has become so much better. I have to say, the Sky Tours, even though I find Wiggins a cool guy somehow, I thought they were brutally boring. I couldn't watch them, they were just, it was just destructive riding. There was always one highlight, somehow when Chris Froome sits on the top tube and keeps pedaling, highlight 1, or Chris Froome, the bike breaks and he jogs up the mountain, also a sick highlight. The Tour, yeah mega, but the Tour when Egan Bernal won or Geraint Thomas, I thought was super boring. Terribly boring Tour de France. Now you couldn't even watch. They just completely passed me by.

Björn: Yeah. Yeah, I have to say, the Tour this year was really brilliant. Really sick fun. Yeah. Good. Good. Last topic, closer topic.

Niclas: Closer topic, the most important topic for the listeners. But we'll go really deep on that. We can dive in a bit deeper next time. Maybe people can ask us funny questions about what we should pay attention to. But we're talking about the Ötztaler.

Björn: Yeah, last week King of the Lake time trial, now Ötztaler. Mhm. 226.2 kilometers, 5500 vertical meters with the current course, record time 6:49:14. Who's the threat? Well, with the current course it's Jack Burke. Ah, Jack Burke. Yeah, yeah, exactly. You have to say, there was 2009, the overall record was actually 2019 Matthias Nothegger. The course was even 11 kilometers longer back then. It was 238 kilometers with 5500 vertical meters. And he rode it in 6:47. Crazy. So that's actually even more to be valued. But that's why I specifically said, with the current course as it is now, the record is Jack Burke's. It's definitely already, if you think about it, 227 kilometers, 5500 vertical meters in under seven hours, is already pretty bananas.

Niclas: Yeah, I'd love to see Seewald really go at it there. That would be sick to see how much faster they could ride.

Björn: If you put a Tour de France pro on the course now, let's say Pogačar or Vingegaard, would there be a 6:30? No, right? Maybe a low 6:40.

Niclas: They barely lose performance. That's the amazing thing, even at altitude. I'll simulate that for next time.

Björn: Okay, that's true. That would be a good idea.

Niclas: And you can have a team at the start, then the world gets even better.

Björn: Yeah okay, that's, I think, you always have to add. These times, someone will pull you up the Brenner Pass, but if you have, no idea, a Nils Politt pulling you up Brenner and just going full gas and pulling the field behind him, that's something different than if... in quotes, you ride up with a competitor who also plans to ride the other passes afterwards briskly. So I think, if you really have a whole team on it, you can get another time out of it.

Niclas: Yeah.

Björn: I'm just checking if I even have the Ötztaler in there. Yeah, we have it. Of course it's in there, pretty sure.

Niclas: Oh, yeah, from this year someone was already diligent, already loaded in.

Björn: Well, it's only four weeks, five weeks now. I don't even know exactly. Let me check. Yeah, four weeks until Ötzi now. This week is Arlberg Giro on Sunday and then we have, let's say, after this week it's another three real training weeks and then it's basically tapering for Ötzi. It'll be, I have to say, in the past years, what I always find so exciting about this race, it's always some mix. Sometimes you have ultra shit weather, and sometimes you have brutal heat where everyone dies on the Timmelsjoch.

Niclas: It's never really good there, no matter what.

Björn: Yeah, you don't even have this relaxed day, like 20 degrees, so easy peasy, you can just ride through calmly. It's just a race, and I find that sick about the Alps. You basically have to be prepared for everything, and you'll always have some extreme actually.

Niclas: Yeah, definitely. The altitude makes it in the end, and the length. And if you cope well with altitude, the Timmels doesn't completely kill you. Yeah. That's the trick, yeah. So basically everyone has to prepare well for it, because that's where the race is decided. Yeah, at the beginning, what do you climb? Kühtai, I think, and then it goes there. Brenner. Brenner, until then everyone's hanging in the group as a rule. Yeah. And then it all falls apart, yeah. And, yeah, yeah.

Björn: Yeah, Jaufenpass is again a thing with 15 kilometers. And then just Timmelsjoch 29 kilometers too.

Niclas: After our Attersee thing, that we're doing next year, we do Ötztaler the year after.

Björn: Yeah, I was actually just about to suggest that I just do Ötztaler next year. I'd like to ride it once, in quotes, relaxed, and then learn from it and try to ride it fast. Yeah. Yeah. Also riding that long, really, sorry. No, I wouldn't have a problem with that. I just don't want to deal with the altitude.

Niclas: The altitude would be okay, but I mean this, eh, no, I really don't want that. And then you know, you know exactly, at a thing like that, you know, at a time trial like that, you know, it's just from start to end somehow, it starts gross and ends grosser. And at the Ötztaler you know, okay, it starts like this, and then it's gross, and then it's okay again, and then it's really gross, and then, it's just like a wave, with waves so to speak, you have to cope with that somehow. You have to, boah, you have to mentally pull yourself together every time. That works, but...

Björn: I have to say, at these very, very long races, I think somehow up to halfway it's usually, if you don't blow up at the first climb, it's usually well bearable. So that's doable. And then it starts to get gross, and you have to cope mentally, okay, you're riding, no idea, on the Jaufenpass your legs start hurting and you know, okay, you have to get up the Jaufenpass with this power, doesn't matter if the legs hurt or not. And then you still have to get up the Timmelsjoch, and ideally with the same power. At these ultra races, that's always stuff, you have to... Or I usually do it like this, I know, okay, this is going to hurt, and I try to somehow talk it up, that the pain isn't that bad or whatever. So adjusting to this pain a bit and knowing, okay, what's coming, how much will it hurt, and then coming up with a strategy or these talks in your head, how do I talk this up so that I can handle this pain, no idea, for another two hours or so.

Niclas: I simulated it on the side. Sorry, couldn't resist. But just for me. Actually, it's totally interesting. The system would currently say, you first ride down. You ride that up relatively relaxed. Yeah, I'd ride that up somehow with 260 watts. And that's not even hard. I actually rode that once at some Trans Alp years ago.

Björn: Did you do that with your performance level or with what value? Yeah, with my performance level.

Niclas: I rode it up exactly like that once before. It was easy. With my then team partner who wasn't as good, I even rode circles. So, then comes Brenner. Also not wild. And at kilometer 140, Jaufen starts, I think. Interestingly, the system says, you have to hammer full gas up there, that's where you can make the difference, boom, and then Jaufen full gas up, and then comes Timmelsjoch, and Timmelsjoch you actually have to ride at your own pace, that would be the optimal energy distribution, and then you ride up with only 240 watts. Start down with 250, 260, I'd ride in that case. And then from 2000 I'd reduce the power to 240. And the total time would be 7 hours 48. Okay. Burned one kilo of carbs. Charming. Average wattage 192.

Björn: That would be good. Yeah, that would also be good. And the time, so under 8 to ride it would already be sick.

Niclas: Yeah, you just have to save brutally on energy. That's actually the whole trick. You can't at the beginning... Sure, you have to catch the group, that's clear. But the most energy you spend... Yeah, up and out. What would happen if we took a really crazy threshold?

Björn: Grab a Pogačar. So let's say 64 kilos with, no idea, 430 watt threshold.

Niclas: So, and he has a crazy W-prime too. Aero 7.2. That's already a sporty aero. So I've pulled some tricks aerodynamically of course. Can't forget that.

Björn: You rode that basically in TT position with your 192 watt average.

Niclas: Yeah, pretty much. If you just...

Björn: If you ride in an aerodynamic position for a long time, you'd unlikely think it works going up such climbs.

Niclas: So, I've now chosen a pretty aerodynamic position. Okay. Pogačar can do that too. Yeah, he can also do it, yeah. A 27 CdA value is already aerodynamic. Now it takes forever until the thing is calculated, because there are pretty many kilometers. We once had someone who wanted to, no, not someone, an athlete of mine, Daniel Steinhauser, who calculated the Race Across Italy. That's somehow 700-something kilometers. Yeah, the system was already at the limit there, but it worked wonderfully.

Björn: But I think, what you can definitely tell people, is use it basically always when you ride over the top, use this time to refuel. Eat whatever you can, because when you roll down the mountain, you can refuel much better than when you're climbing under load. Of course on the climbs you also have to drink and stuff, but for example pushing in large amounts of gels or whatever. I noticed that again this weekend. Make a good plan for when to take how many carbs, and take these carbs when your breathing and your gastrointestinal system aren't as maxed out as when you're, no idea, climbing full gas or at tempo. It makes a difference. And it just makes it easier. That means push, no idea, you ride over the top and then you shove in two gels and chug 500 milliliters of water. It feels bad in the first moment. But then you ride a quarter hour downhill, then roll a bit flat through the valley, and when you go into the next climb, you're fresh again and have the energy in the system.

Niclas: And aero really makes a lot of difference. So staying in the group as much as possible. That would be super, super important. And also clothing-wise it makes sense. When you're out alone, you ride over 16 km/h, aerodynamics eventually make sense.

Björn: Yeah, I think... Just these really simple things. Skinsuit, if it's not brutally hot, a halfway aerodynamic helmet, shave arms and legs, aero gloves, aero socks. Those are things, it's not ultra much effort, but just doing that... you save real time at the end of an Ötzi. And I say in comparison, if you also have good carb refueling, put a plan in place, I also always find it interesting, many athletes say, yeah, I don't have feeders who stand on the road and give me a bottle. Here, my stage race partner Aaron, he just made himself a wooden post that he can position bottles on. And he just drives to the course beforehand, hammers this wooden post or two wooden posts in at two positions, then he has four bottles on the course. Yeah, super easy. Then you have your refueling more or less ready, and don't need any feeder. Sure, if 5000 people do that at Ötzi, the course will look pretty funny. But just the idea. I also once said to an athlete, he lives for example near a race, then you ride to the course. Then you position a drinking bladder or a hydration pack behind tree X, ride by. What does that cost you? You ride by on the climb, stop briefly, get off the bike, grab your hydration pack, get back on the bike. So at most, 30 seconds. But then you have good carb refueling. And when you bonk and don't have any carb refueling left, we're not talking about a 30-second time loss anymore.

Niclas: Andi Seewald won World Cups or World Series just like that, I think, was it in Forestière? He wasn't at Canyon back then. Drove around in his old Ford Galaxy or S-Max or whatever.

Björn: Is Forestière the race where he also slept in the car and let the rice cooker run in the car?

Niclas: Exactly. And then he hid the bottles and then he just drove out front, with Huber and co. behind him. And then he quickly grabbed the bottle in between. I think that's how it was. Yeah.

Björn: So you don't always need a whole team if you think a bit, and I say, sure, at Ötzi with such a big loop it's also not that easy to deposit bottles. You have to have some local knowledge and then maybe sit in the car the day before. But fundamentally it's possible, to prepare well, if you really want to go for it. I mean, if you ride the thing and you want to finish, then you can also go through the normal feed zones on site. But I say, if you want to ride a decent time already, bring your own carbs.

Niclas: Are you spending the day before somehow 200-something kilometers in the car, hiding bottles?

Björn: Yeah, but you don't have to. You can now, no idea, you place a hydration pack somewhere before the Jaufenpass. But then someone steals it. Well, you just hide it behind a tree or something. So I've done that too.

Niclas: Very often, when I for example... You hide the camouflage packs. Hydration packs.

Björn: No, I did that, in training I've also done that before. Rode off with four bottles, deposited two bottles somewhere, kept riding, and at some point picked up my two full bottles again.

Niclas: So I've now, I've calculated it, it's totally crazy. With a CdA value of 29, isn't that bad, right? And the climbing CdA value will rise, yeah, to over 30. CdA value downhill 24. Barely any power losses. Though I'd still calculate a power loss at altitude. That means, we go down to 380 at some point. He'd also go full gas at the Jaufenpass. And actually only at the Jaufenpass. The rest you dawdle.

Björn: Yeah, okay, but if we're talking about dawdling now... And we've entered roughly 430 watt threshold. At how many watts is he dawdling?

Niclas: Watch, so he rides off with 330. That's zone 2, Fatmax. Yeah. As hard as that is, that's how it is for him. He'd ride Fatmax up to kilometer 29, 30. Or even partially below. 330, 320, then they ride up with 300, then he rides the mountain up with 380. Kühtai. Tempo range. Tempo, yeah. Then it goes down somehow. Then he rides again 320, 320, 320. Brenner only 320. Yeah, Brenner comes now. And there he rides 360. 370, 380, then he rides 360, 360, 360, 360, then it goes downhill again, you ride 300 again, then it goes really steep once, yeah, meaning he rides up with 440, he completely empties himself there, yeah, he'd do 440. Jaufen too, okay. So, Jaufen you ride with 440, you ride threshold up, completely. Then he comes up at the top. He's empty. But then just comes the descent. On the descent you can't do anything. You just don't pedal. You just roll down. You ride only 240 or so. It's just. Exactly. Then comes Timmelsjoch. 380. Then from 2000 you go down to 350, 360. Then you roll down and then you ride this thing in 6 hours, I estimate 6 hours 4, 6 hours 10. And I think with a team, with a team, you might even with a completely aerodynamically optimized setup and if they really go full gas, keep you out of the wind the whole time, under 6 hours.

Björn: Are you telling me that if we, assuming we had an eight-man UAE team in top lineup and they rode it for Pogačar, you could ride it under six hours? Yeah, I think so. You have to think about this. If you already look at what a Jack Burke is tearing off with 6:49, which is already really, so Jack Burke really has very good wattage. He's really a very good climber and I always say, on these Alpine marathons, he's a top rider. So he also has no crazy power losses at altitude. He has no crazy power losses on the back end. He's already, regarding these races, very optimized. Uh... that just another 50 minutes are sitting on the road. I think so.

Niclas: And I think it's all aerodynamics. And where do you invest energy?

Björn: Old Swede, that's insane.

Niclas: So, if you especially on the Kühtai, you have to, I get the idea of saying, hey, we'll make some noise at Kühtai already so we can drop some people. But ideally the thing is, you just don't ride full gas up it. I mean, at 63 kilos he rides, I mean, he still rides 6 watts up there.

Björn: That's so dumb. That's so dumb. If you think about it, he rides the first climb at 6 watts per kilogram, that's a threshold that almost no one outside the WorldTour achieves. So outside the WorldTour really only the top pros achieve that. And I'd say, normally with a threshold of 5.4 to 5.5, 5.6 watts per kilogram, you're already a really, really good rider where you can win mountain bike marathon races really well, where you'd normally win all road races as an Elite rider normally. Uh. That's just dumb.

Niclas: But I've also optimized the aero already a bit. He's not sitting there somehow with a flapping jersey, but it's already... Not like Remco. So that's already, that's already good. That's already good. Ah, I have to do this again, sorry, everyone who doesn't feel like it anymore, you can stop, hang up, yeah.

Björn: Well, I think after we've now said that it's possible to ride Ötzi under six hours, a few have probably said, yeah come on, let these two talk. Hung up. Everyone who's ridden this thing and is listening to this now says, yeah come on, you two are sitting here in front of the computer talking nonsense.

Niclas: Flicky-clacky, right? By the way, I was pretty good with my numbers, right? Now I predicted everything correctly.

Björn: That's also the thing again, because you know that you basically predicted the Tour de France time trial this year on the mountain to the second.

Niclas: And the other time trial I was also really good. And another story now too. Marc Stutzmann rode this stage race in Spain, Colina Trieste. And he'd said, Björn, I need pacing and so on. I don't know the course and I always overdo it and and and and. Then he says, yeah, we're heading off now, two hours, race duration probably about an hour and a half. Then I simulated it and came up with, it's hard, mountain bike is super hard because you never know the terrain, and then I came out at 1:16 and gave him the pacing. He rode it, 1:17. Oh shit. And he says, he couldn't believe it. He says he won the whole thing overall against Diaz. He says he lost above all in the descents.

Björn: Yeah, Diaz is also someone who is incredibly good at trail races. So if you look at Diaz's results, on press-down courses in quotes he's a good pro, on trail courses, look, on Elba back then almost a pure trail course, he just takes third. Or even second? Third GGM. Where you think, huh?

Niclas: Yeah, totally. And he knew, knows the course inside and out, because his girlfriend lives there. So we were pretty close there, which of course made me totally happy. And Marc was like, that can't be possible. Why am I riding exactly the time that was predicted? Yeah, it just happens. So, now let's do it, Niclas, let me set you up with threshold 400 watts, 300, 300, 300.

Björn: Look, if we now look at my data last week, last week, I'd say, I rode you 420 for over an hour.

Niclas: Let's take 400, just like that.

Björn: Yeah, you have to add, at 300 meters of elevation. As soon as altitude comes into play for me, I'm really ass. Sorry, Aaron. You'll unfortunately have to wait for me in Switzerland again.

Niclas: Yeah, I want to run you through again.

Björn: With Niclas I can also ride at altitude, though only from 200... If we say I'd do Ötzi, then I'd make sure we, no idea, chill three weeks in Livigno five weeks beforehand. I can somehow make that happen.

Niclas: We just have to make sure the heart minute volume doesn't drop too much. Then we have to hit a few intervals in Bormio now and then. After, no idea, ten days. Bormio is nice. We can do that. Yeah, exactly. Always have to go down. So I'm calculating that now funnily enough. Let's see what comes out.

Björn: Have to say, Bike-Discount Radon has at least brought a suitable bike for it now. They have a new climbing bike now. I think aero is even more important. Would you, would you rather ride Ötzi with a, let's say a 7 or 7.5 kilo bike that's more aerodynamic, or with a super lightweight 6.5 or, I mean at Ötzi you can do anything, you can also ride a 5.5, a 6 kilo bike at Ötzi.

Niclas: Yeah. That would be an exciting thing, I'll calculate that next time, because that would go deeply beyond the scope. The Tour does that, the Tour magazine always did that, calculated such things. We'll calculate various scenarios now, I can do that, what a really light bike brings, but not quite as aerodynamically optimized. Let's see what comes out. Though, what's especially decisive there is the frame. And the position, I'll think of something about how much comes out.

Björn: But you have to, if you for example looked at Visma at the Tour, very often relatively low to very low wheels, but basically always on the S5 and always in the aerodynamic position.

Niclas: Sure, I mean, when was Campenaerts not riding the aero helmet?

Björn: Yeah, but that's also, sorry, that's unpleasant. Huge respect for what a racer Campenaerts was at the Tour this year. Ultra sick. If you've seen the past years, yeah okay, won a Tour stage last year too, but... What a development he's made again at Visma. And I think, you see a bit, the rider is fully thriving in this team because he's just so nerdy about aerodynamics. And they fully support him in that. I think he's having the time of his life in this team. That's so much fun for him. At least that's how it comes across. But this helmet, it really looks so shit. Sorry. I've been thinking about getting it. No, Björn, no, no, no, no, no, no. So, if we do King of the Lake time trial, then we can wear it, okay. Or such an aero helmet, whatever, right? For a time trial okay, but wearing an aero helmet outside of a time trial, yeah, that doesn't work. It looks so shit.

Niclas: That's so unpleasant. At King of the Lake we, we have to check the rules again, can we wear any aero helmet? Also on the road bike? I think so, right?

Björn: I think King of the Lake doesn't have any, no regulations in that regard. I think if you, for example, take a road bike, in this road bike category, I think we'd also be allowed to mount aerobars on it.

Niclas: No, we can't. I don't think so. Really? Nope.

Björn: Okay, I see, we have to deal with that.

Niclas: If we ride any aero helmet, then we'll of course ride, so I'll ride the aero helmet from Zero. Or the POC.

Björn: So I'd probably rather ride the aerodynamic POC road helmet that Healy also rode a lot. Yeah. My athlete at Rock am Ring, who also got the 24-hour record time, also rode it completely there. I think that still goes okay, but what I'd most like is, no idea, just ride a Game Changer or Mad Manta, Specialized Evade, something like that, but... Probably if we want to really optimize the thing, we have to wear a real time trial helmet.

Niclas: So that we really embarrass ourselves to the bone, if we then need something like an hour 15.

Björn: Yeah, but we'll get there. We'll get there.

Niclas: So, Niclas, we're still calculating.

Björn: It takes a bit longer. Yeah, it's because I'm heavier. That's why the system takes longer. The system thinks, no, with that weight you're not riding Ötzi, forget it.

Niclas: Body Mass Index blows everything. Body Mass Index 33.

Björn: Now comes errors, they're too heavy. Please lose weight.

Niclas: Yeah, please lose weight. Does help at some point. Tour de France of the women, we didn't even talk about it. My god.

Björn: Sorry, but first day, unbelievably sick, how Pauline attacked that thing. And I thought, so I thought, it looked like, is she not pulling through on purpose, or were her legs gone? I thought, was it really planned that Marianne should take it then, and she rode this attack to put the others under pressure? But I actually thought, it looked like her legs were just dead.

Niclas: She was just cooked. No idea. And yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's see, yeah. The hard stages are still coming. I'm curious about Demi Vollering, who also crashed a bit.

Björn: Yeah, that was yesterday, right?

Niclas: Yeah. Do we know anything yet? So I read that she, unfortunately I could hardly watch anything the last two days, she definitely did the concussion protocol, la di da, and this morning she was supposed to be checked again. So I assume she'll ride, but why did she actually crash? I didn't catch it at all.

Björn: It was a big mass crash in the right curve, I think. Yeah, she went down with it, and she had to be pushed for the first meters at least, didn't lose time because it was in those last five kilometers, but still, I think it's difficult if you had such a hard crash to really perform the next days.

Niclas: really to perform. Yeah, Marlen Reusser is already out. Yeah, but she was also sick beforehand, had a stomach flu, then crashed again, and yeah, shame really. But it's always like that, if you go in so weakened, it usually doesn't work out.

Björn: For the story I'd find it ultra sick if Pauline wins it now, then that woman has really won everything you can win in women's cycling.

Niclas: Yeah, she could still do track.

Björn: And she could also still become Olympic champion in the road race.

Niclas: But then she's won pretty much everything you can win. She'll win it. You think? Yeah. She's so focused on it, and you also see this metamorphosis of her body, she's completely geared toward winning this thing.

Björn: Yeah, that's really sick, right? Yeah. That's really, also probably has the best team backing her. If it runs through like that, it'll be exciting. Yeah.

Niclas: Niclas, I made a mistake. I think we have to leave it. We'll pick it up next time.

Björn: Okay. That means, next time the simulation we need to do is climbing bike vs. aerodynamic setup.

Niclas: Yeah.

Björn: Then simulate me through, in quotes, a heavier rider.

Niclas: Yeah, like a normal rider.

Björn: Then just a pacing strategy for, let's say, the average rider. Let's say 75 kilos and 300 watts threshold.

Niclas: Everyone can calculate this pacing strategy themselves, if they go to our website, at Afasteryou. But I'll simulate various scenarios, above all the scenario, does light make sense, or does aero make sense from a certain point? Do I invest 2000 euros in a wheelset or do I maybe sit a bit differently on the bike? Yeah. Yeah.

Björn: Now to close, because it's still four weeks. What's your last training tip for the last four weeks?

Niclas: Watch out, now it gets completely, how should I say, uncool. I would ride tempo training. You actually never ride threshold, or rarely. Maybe once. But actually you sometimes ride sweet spot.

Björn: As a hobby and amateur athlete you actually, ideally, ride at most sweet spot.

Niclas: Yeah, I would ride the whole time in this unpopular training range, tempo. And that a lot, long, I would ride super much, I would ride long, I would also bonk a few times in training, eaten a bit too little and so on. That does it. As hard as that is, that really does it, because that's what most athletes lack, is the length. A cycling pro, we have it easy there, yeah, that's like people who come from the Continental team ride the first 150 kilometers with the road, with the real WorldTour pros, and then they say, hey, up to kilometer 150 everything easy, and then nothing more. Sure, because most Conti riders don't race 200-plus kilometers either, they just ride 150 and so on. And the length is what makes the difference, long riding, Fatmax, zone 2, tempo training, also sometimes, that's also a training I do with some athletes, I had recently, well, not recently, someone asked me, a WorldTour coach, hey, how do you actually do that, he comes from mountain biking, rode really well there, in the World Cup, really, really good, how do we get him to ride well over the length? And then I said, yeah, after the World Cup let him ride 200 kilometers the next day. They did, that was a while ago now. And then he rides really stable over the Tour or whatever. And just simply, beat the lactate production down. And that's the best way. It's not quite as destructive. You can eat back reasonably well, but the energy turnover is still so high that you can't eat it all back, and just really ride long. Every weekend really, really ride long. Test material, get a good feeling again, sure, check brakes really before you ride the thing, really brakes, new tires, new chain, the whole thing already ridden for a week. Please don't change it the day before, change it all a week before. So that the tire already sits on the rim, the chain already, the chain lock is properly tight, the brake pads are already broken in a bit.

Björn: But only a bit, because you need lots of brake pads.

Niclas: Yeah, exactly. Not like back then Jens Schwedler, with whom I rode North German Championships many hundred years ago. And who, with completely worn-down brakes, I mean really, the brakes were completely gone. You have, and that was still the rim-brake era, and you just had this metal-plastic stuff. And so he came to the finish. It was also fine weather that day. That was sick. But Jens Schwedler could do that. He was also German champion in cyclocross once. On a trekking bike, so to speak. Because I think Stevens at the time when he became German cross champion didn't even have a cross bike in their lineup yet. Just imagine that. That was really... I dare to remember that it was really practically just a kind of trekking bike. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly.

Björn: Good, then next week we do Ötzi again and talk through a few simulations.

Niclas: And people should, when they hear it, ask some questions about what else we can answer.

Björn: Best. Best is actually either DM me or DM me on Instagram, then we see it best.

Niclas: Exactly, or alternatively also with Afasteryou, I see it there too. And then we'll manage it. I hope we're not too nerdy. I listened to the last podcast. I rarely listen to my podcast, but then I listened to it in the car with the family. And then at some point I thought, how many people are still following along? And that wasn't even high-tech, far off, yeah. But the topic is very niche, I'd say. But my wife liked it. My sons fell asleep.

Björn: Well, that's also okay. You had a quieter car ride. Right. Very nice. Björn, then until next week. We'll talk. Ciao, ciao.